Friday, May 27, 2016

Just came across this, and the assertion that "based on the overwhelming evidence from Scripture...we can be assured that the Saints in heaven can hear our prayers and are praying for us" is absurd, while it offers no support for praying to created beings in Heaven.

[] "Jesus is telling us that those in heaven are alive" simply does not translate into believers (there is no Scriptural distinction btwn believers and "saints") having the power and privilege of constantly hearing prayers from earth, mental or oral, which only God is shown to possess, to His glory.

[]"Jesus talks to Moses and Elijah, who are very aware of what has been happening on earth," but as with all other instances of tow-way communication btwn beings from Heaven (except God) and earth, this required created beings to be in the same realm, versus them constantly hearing prayers from Heaven, as only God is shown able to do.

Moreover, the only evidence of them knowing what was happening on earth was that they "spake of his decease which he should accomplish at Jerusalem," (Luke 9:31) which was prophesied, and thus does not even require them to know what was occurring on earth, except that this was the mission of Christ.

Regardless, it remains that believers in Heaven knowing what is occurring on earth, or even them praying for the elect, or even hearing prayer, does not translate into evidence of anyone praying to them or support for this.

[] "The Book of Hebrews echoes this when it teaches that those who have gone before us into heaven still witness what happens on earth."

No, contextually the "great cloud of witnesses" does not speak of being watched by believers in Heaven, but is rhetorically speaking about being in the memorial company of those whose testimonies of faith preceded them. These souls are memorials to faith, akin to the stones that were in the midst of the river of Jordan being a memorial unto the children of Israel for ever. (Joshua 4:7)

[] "What I believe is the most amazing evidence from the Bible of the Saints in heaven hearing our prayers is from the book of Revelation".

That you find this amazing is a problem, since neither Revelations 5:8 or 8:3-5 teaches that the entities hear prayers, but only that they offer them up as a memorial before the finals judgments, like as in Lv. 2:2,15,16; 24:7; Num. 5:15, "an offering of memorial," versus regularly hearing such and being a delivery service.

[] "Those in heaven could not rejoice over a sinner repenting on earth unless they knew about it."

This does testify to angels knowing of conversions, which could simply be by knowing another souls was added to the Lamb's book of life, yet in any case this simply fails to support praying to created beings, nor that they actually constantly hear prayers to them.

Rather than an overwhelming evidence from Scripture supporting prayer to created beings in glory, there are appox. 200 prayers to Heaven in Scripture, and absolutely none of them are to anyone else in Heaven but the Lord God - except by pagans. And if such was talking then the utter absence of even one example of such is even more inexplicable in the light of prayer being a most basic practice. Instead it is simply a tradition of men, for which Catholics abuse Scripture in trying to extrapolate some support.

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